Goetic Evocation...

[Nagual-Hoor-Lam]

Deciding to take wheat flour out of a recipe is fine, but make sure you put an appropriate substitute, not just gummy bears because they are your favorite snack.

The cooking analogy is getting a fair bit of mileage.

[FESU]

Dear Jackal96,

I was wondering, is there a specific reason you are using Anpu? Why not Upuat?
Anpu in GD is connected to the Kerux and Upuat to the Sentinel.
If I were to take a God-form for protection, that would be Upuat.
He is indeed very powerful and his energy very strong.
But...one question...what kind of a relationship you want to obtain with the Goetic spirit?
What I'm trying to say is...I have used Upuat to protect my family and myself from an experiment that went wrong.
This made me unreachable by the spirit but at the same time directed the energy of the spirit to other members of my family with not so pleasant results.
You are trying to call someone...just make sure that he can reach you and you don't piss him off. This is all my friend.
Good luck with anything that you are doing.

[raum215]

Or, just maybe the godform of the hiereus might be better suited as it is he who is the real warden of the temple from the dread forces...m hmm.

[FESU]

I've been thinking about this and in terms of symbology in the temple, maybe Haarparkrat would work better as he is the one opposing the evil force, represented by Apep/Apophis.
The reason I'm saying this is that the Hiereus stands on the throne of the west and he is on the verge of darkness.
Raum you are right in the sense that he is the one that protects the temple with the help of Anpu and Upuat, but I have the feeling that if you were to use these Godforms, then you would probably end up blocking the energies that you are trying to summon.
On the other hand, Haarparkrat is opposing evil and in a sense keeps the balance between good and evil.
In that sense, taking the form of Haarparkrat would enable you to face any dark entity on equal terms.
What do you think about this? Makes sense?

[raum215]

the heireus and hegemon (HRU and MAAT) are both responsible for the space immediately east of the altar of the mystic repast. THAT is yesod and the point of evil IN the temple. Ahooreist takes wing to this station in the reception of the candidate, but it is the hiereus who allows it to exist, and the hegemon it is attracted to.

keep in mind the lamen of the Hs as well, as his role in the opening of the temple and the reception of the candidate.

[jackal96]

Dear Jackal96,

I was wondering, is there a specific reason you are using Anpu? Why not Upuat?
Anpu in GD is connected to the Kerux and Upuat to the Sentinel.
If I were to take a God-form for protection, that would be Upuat.
He is indeed very powerful and his energy very strong.
But...one question...what kind of a relationship you want to obtain with the Goetic spirit?
What I'm trying to say is...I have used Upuat to protect my family and myself from an experiment that went wrong.
This made me unreachable by the spirit but at the same time directed the energy of the spirit to other members of my family with not so pleasant results.
You are trying to call someone...just make sure that he can reach you and you don't piss him off. This is all my friend.
Good luck with anything that you are doing.

The reason being, that I have only started working in the Golden Dawn tradition proper. At the original time of the post (And technically still now) I am more Kemetic based (although I have. In Kemet, both Anpu AND Wepwawet/Upuat are reffered to as Opener of ways as well as protective deities. Therefore they wouldn't necasserily block the energy but "Open the way" to it if you understand my meaning?. Although that was more a role of Wepwawet/Upuat admittidly, and I see your point there. As I am more knowledgable in the area's of Kemetic Ritual work, this is...No WAS the area I was focusing upon for the specific ritual, although thats changed to a more GD oriented style.

The question regarding relationship...is an interesting one, lol. I am currently not going in with the intent to constrain and "Force" the goetic to do my will, but I'm also not going to work with him in the way I'd work with a patron deity or Angelic entity, in the way many demonalterists do. Truth be told I'm probably gonna see how the evocation itself turns out, and the spirits attitude towards me treating it with apathy and obviously respect. Hence the desire to invoke a protective deity for the proceedings.

Although originally, at the time of writing of the original post it seemed I was quite ignorant of a lot of things (And still am!). (Donald Michael Kraigs modern Magick was my main source, hence a "Half" knowledge.) So now I'm studying the Golden Dawn tradition proper now via the Cicero's book and a correspondance course online (And if I'm lucky a temple). My knowledge level is literally a bits and pieces of each GD grade from Neophyte to Adeptus minor, thanks to my teachers and there teaching style who scattered everything I learned. Hence I'm beginning from the basics again and re-building myself in a proper manner, so that I can use the information here properly

I think it is due to the fact I've started working with the HGA, (Re-working a slightly more modern Abramelin) and I have a feeling he is telling me to balance myself proper before Goetia.

Apologies if I came of In-coherant. Fatiqued mentally. Many thanks for all the suggestions.

[Bluefirephoenix]

I'd suggest messing with the grimiore at first to get the feel for the magical stream your working with then once you have a good feel for it follow more intuitive paths with it. I worked with the Goetia briefly. I didn't find the spirits that interesting to work with to be honest. I did the grimiore verbatum but didn't get into the torture thing. I recieved some interesting information that I had been looking for for the rune work I was doing as well. Thats about all I got out of it. I liked the Theurgia spirits much better. Much more friendly and enjoyable to work with and I related to them better. The setup is used for both spirits and there is some additional conjurations used out of Stegnegraphia which are kinda fun because they have a double meaning. They're both encoded letters to priests and such and used for the spirits.

If I were going to continue it I'd work on dumping some of the Christian stuff I don't really feel comfortable with it and feel that the spirits come because they're interested in working with people. It depends on your perspective. If you want them to come across as sulferous raging demons they won't disappoint you. I will say they will test you before hand when you set your intention firmly don't be suprised if you see this spirit messing with you. But even angels will do that sometimes.

If the spirit was really out to get rid of you and could be restrained as the grimiore implies he'd do so now after you've announced to the world your going to expose him to the tortures of the grimiore. See my point? The spirit is there already. Just an intention and focus on it's name is enough to get it's attention. Believe it's powerful enough to cause lots of trouble if it didn't want this evocation to happen.

[Aliga]

If the spirit was really out to get rid of you and could be restrained as the grimiore implies he'd do so now after you've announced to the world your going to expose him to the tortures of the grimiore. See my point? The spirit is there already. Just an intention and focus on it's name is enough to get it's attention. Believe it's powerful enough to cause lots of trouble if it didn't want this evocation to happen.

I do feel its worth mentioning, in my experience just focusing on its name isn't normally enough to call the attention of a spirit - especially if the person focusing isn't terribly experienced/powerful (not assuming to know the level if either the op has, of course). It still takes me a good amount of concentration and actively trying to achieve a decent level of gnosis to do any evocation, and I very rarely will "accidentally" calk the attention of any kind of spirit.